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11 Apr 2006 - 16:50
Clowes: So Project Follow Through confirmed what you had already found about the ineffectiveness of those other programs. Yet those programs still are being promoted in teacher colleges and they still are widely used, while Direct Instruction is not. Why? Engelmann: The answer is really simple, but it's very difficult for most people to accept: Outcomes have never been a priority in public education, from its inception. That's the way the public education system is. The system is more concerned with the experience of the child: "Let the child explore," "Let the child be his or her self," "Don't interfere with the natural learning process," and so on.
source: "If Children Aren't Learning, We're Not Teaching" interview
Causality, Causality, Causality: The View of Education Inputs and Outputs from Economics The paper is here. (pdf file)
key words: blame the student school psychologist
Pamela Darr Wright summary of Galen Alessi study
Evolving Functions for the School Psychologist
Whose Fault Is It?
educational rights of special need children versus typical children
Engelmann on Galen Alessi study
Pamela Darr Wright posted to ktm
"public school has never been about outputs..."
-- CatherineJohnson - 11 Apr 2006 Back to main page.
Please consider registering as a regular user.
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The increased emphasis on testing may have caused schools to look at outputs more, but parents never see what the "output" (test score) represents. Last month was ISAT testing. Next November, we'll get the scores, but no indication of what the questions were, or what our child answered. As if a week of ISAT's weren't enough, the next couple weeks are "district assessments" where they supposedly test on the "curriculum expectations." Parents never see the results, or the questions. There are also "pre" and "post" year assessments given in Math and Language Arts; parents never see these either. I've pressed for some of this info at IEP meetings with varying degrees of success. -- KathyIggy - 11 Apr 2006
Next November, we'll get the scores, but no indication of what the questions were, or what our child answered. exactly I keep re-telling my Christopher-can't-measure story. At some point it will be funny, but 'I'm not there yet.' He abjectly flunked the subscale called 'measurement' on last year's TONYSS test. (Test of New York State Standards - a privately created test given in off years, i.e. not in grades 4 or 8) No one in the school could tell me anything about what was on that subscale. -- CatherineJohnson - 11 Apr 2006
We're on a rampage, and we won't get off our rampage until we get some answers. We want:
inputs and outputs
Clowes: So Project Follow Through confirmed what you had already found about the ineffectiveness of those other programs. Yet those programs still are being promoted in teacher colleges and they still are widely used, while Direct Instruction is not. Why? Engelmann: The answer is really simple, but it's very difficult for most people to accept: Outcomes have never been a priority in public education, from its inception. That's the way the public education system is. The system is more concerned with the experience of the child: "Let the child explore," "Let the child be his or her self," "Don't interfere with the natural learning process," and so on.
source: "If Children Aren't Learning, We're Not Teaching" interview
Causality, Causality, Causality: The View of Education Inputs and Outputs from Economics The paper is here. (pdf file)
key words: blame the student school psychologist
Pamela Darr Wright summary of Galen Alessi study
Evolving Functions for the School Psychologist
Whose Fault Is It?
educational rights of special need children versus typical children
Engelmann on Galen Alessi study
Pamela Darr Wright posted to ktm
"public school has never been about outputs..."
-- CatherineJohnson - 11 Apr 2006 Back to main page.
Comments
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Look here for syntax help.
The increased emphasis on testing may have caused schools to look at outputs more, but parents never see what the "output" (test score) represents. Last month was ISAT testing. Next November, we'll get the scores, but no indication of what the questions were, or what our child answered. As if a week of ISAT's weren't enough, the next couple weeks are "district assessments" where they supposedly test on the "curriculum expectations." Parents never see the results, or the questions. There are also "pre" and "post" year assessments given in Math and Language Arts; parents never see these either. I've pressed for some of this info at IEP meetings with varying degrees of success. -- KathyIggy - 11 Apr 2006
Next November, we'll get the scores, but no indication of what the questions were, or what our child answered. exactly I keep re-telling my Christopher-can't-measure story. At some point it will be funny, but 'I'm not there yet.' He abjectly flunked the subscale called 'measurement' on last year's TONYSS test. (Test of New York State Standards - a privately created test given in off years, i.e. not in grades 4 or 8) No one in the school could tell me anything about what was on that subscale. -- CatherineJohnson - 11 Apr 2006
We're on a rampage, and we won't get off our rampage until we get some answers. We want:
- copies of 'A' essays
- copies of solution sheets for math exams and assignments
- syllabus for each and every course
- scope and sequence for each and every course
- complete breakdown of every single skill and fact Christopher knew at the beginning of 6th grade
- complete breakdown of every single skill and fact Christopher is supposed to know at the end of 6th grade
| WebLogForm | |
|---|---|
| Title: | inputs and outputs |
| TopicType: | WebLog |
| SubjectArea: | DirectInstruction, EducationResearch |
| LogDate: | 200604111250 |